Off-Season Rules Discussion

[jerrydlux]

No need to apologize. The grades for QB do matter in a scenario mentioned where a real backup becomes a starter here. QBs with high grades get higher default updates while QBs with low grades get worse default updates. Like all from there, the supporting team grades vs defense grades further adjust those initial stat updates.

It's always something to look at and try to further improve, though.[/quote]


So then maybe looking at the default grades based on ratings? I was just looking at Nathan Peterman vs Nick Foles and NP is 72 and Foles is a 73...so I would imagine they would get similar default stats but I would say Madden is missing on that 72 lol

[rabbitrun]

With the constant increasing cap, the NFL continues to one up itself with contracts, particularly the QB position. I think we need to visit the minimum LTC values again for QBs. Probably something that should be looked into every couple of years to keep up with the NFL.

Catching up a bit. I would support raising the minimum LTC for Quarterbacks. There are quite a few up for extensions this year across the leagues too.

[JonC]

The problem with raising minimums across the board (even just for QB), is that it severely limits those who are worthy of an LTC. We only get two a year, sometimes the best course of action is to use one on a B/B+ player. I understand truly elite QB turning down 16-17 million a year when you include signing bonus, but do we want to limit ourselves even further in terms of palatable options?

[tino38]

The problem with raising minimums across the board (even just for QB), is that it severely limits those who are worthy of an LTC. We only get two a year, sometimes the best course of action is to use one on a B/B+ player. I understand truly elite QB turning down 16-17 million a year when you include signing bonus, but do we want to limit ourselves even further in terms of palatable options?

We try to keep this as real as possible. The QB position should be addressed. Kirk Cousins is making $84 million over 3 years in the NFL. No way would Drew Brees sign for anything less than $20 million, considering he just signed a 2 year deal worth $50 million. Even Alex Smith got paid! $94 million over 4 years. Point is, do we want to spend this much money on 1 player, obviously not but if we want this game play to reflect real life then the QB money should reflect that. Right now at the $16-17 million dollar range you proposed, QBs would only be getting $1-2 million more than top WRs when realistically the top QBs are making nearly $10 million more than the best WRs.

I wouldn’t be proposing a huge bump, but I think the salary should at least be $15 million at a bare minimum and then the s/b can be factored in after just like any LTCs, though I could argue that the minimum salary should be closer to $18-20 million or so before s/b.

[JonC]

Poking holes here:

All three of those guys were about to be free agents. All three garnered total money similar to what we'd see guys sign for on exclusive rights tags. Our guaranteed vs. non-guaranteed is way off base, so I'm not even looking at that.

Perhaps we should look at the LTC this way:

Players listed as UFA/RFA are not eligible for LTC negotiations. Open them up one year earlier. 2 years and 1 year remaining are LTC eligible.

[tino38]

Well Brees is also a UFA in the DFFL and if you let him hit FA in the DFFL I have no doubt someone would pay him what he is actually worth and that’s in the $25 million/year range.

Regardless of how you want to do the LTCs, QBs are underpaid by the minimum value right now based on the salary cap increasing and the reality of how much they are being paid in the NFL.

[rabbitrun]

Considering the LTC contracts don’t factor in the signing bonus I would lean towards voting it up to the $18 million range. Guys can be signed to a 1 year $30 million contract with the salary only equalling $1 million and the signing bonus equalling $29 million and then the next year sign a 4 year LTC at the minimum of $10 million per year because the system doesn’t recognize the signing bonus for LTC contracts so yeah I would lean toward the $18 million range.

[JonC]

Well Brees is also a UFA in the DFFL and if you let him hit FA in the DFFL I have no doubt someone would pay him what he is actually worth and that’s in the $25 million/year range.

Regardless of how you want to do the LTCs, QBs are underpaid by the minimum value right now based on the salary cap increasing and the reality of how much they are being paid in the NFL.

We disagree here.

We aren't seeing real life QB sign true extensions in the way we do extensions. They are, in every single case I've found, signing their big deal after 4 years in the league (so 1st rounders are getting that 5th year option dropped, essentially). Because of that, we really have no basis for how we are valuing the LTC in our league for QB specifically. All of these guys are signing what we would deem to be exclusive 4 or 5 year tags. For QB here, those are ~$160MM deals with ~$46MM guaranteed at 5 years.

I'm not at all concerned about Brees in this. You could tell me I'd have to pay $30MM for him next year and I'd figure it out. I'm worried about creating a different problem by trying to solve what you see is a problem right now. The issue we have is that Fake Drew Brees' Fake Agent wouldn't let Brees sign an LTC as a pending FA. He'd tell him to get a tag sized deal or test the market. So rather than artificially inflating the LTC or creating an arbitrary grade cut-off at which point you can no longer sign and LTC, why don't we just change the rules to say that players aren't going to sign an LTC after their contract has expired. You can tag them or they can test the market. On the other side, allow players to sign an LTC 2 years prior to their contract expiring and take their last two years salary average into account when figuring the number so that GMs can't game the system by restructuring and then extending.

[tino38]

You are correct Jon, we definitely disagree here.

[jerrydlux]

i think I see what youre saying JonC....I like it because we use real life franchise tag numbers dont we? So it completely removes any crazy contracts we have

But what happens when teams decide to not field a starting NFL QB and instead invest that money into positions that impact the sim?